Hypothetically speaking, if there is a conflict for influence in Laos between Vietnam and the People’s Republic of China, would Laos be able to declare neutrality without being dragged into a war by either side? To this day, I believe that Laos has absolute power to independently exercise her domestic and foreign policy without the need to seek permission from Hanoi Vietnam unless I am wrong otherwise. I hate to see history repeats itself. If Laos is directly or indirectly compelled to choose side or under intense pressure to declare political allegiance, it would be a national political crisis again as it had happened to Laos during Indochina War. Without a doubt, there would be a great division among dignitaries in Laotian Communist Bureaucracy; the pro-Vietnam and the pro-China can be armed by both sides and fight a nasty civil war. The potential armament of the Hmong rebels by the Americans can resume and exacerbate the all out war to which Laos would face a political and military dilemma.
In the past, there was nothing more “This Land of a Million Elephants”ever wanted (under the King Savang Vatthana) than becoming a peacefully neutral nation, but it was unfortunate that Laos was plunged into an impasse of rising tensions among Pathet Lao Army, Vietnam Army, Royal Army and the Hmong Army. The dirty war had caused so much pain and suffering for all innocent Laotian citizens who had to endure until the end of the Indochina War. The constant attack on Royal Laotian Government by the Viet Army indicated their intentional breaching the Geneva Convention by which they never honored or respected as agreed upon.
Laos in the 21st century, must not repeat this mistake; it should not matter who is in power, the emphasis should be about unity and the rebuilding of Laotian economy should be based on the ideology of capitalism not communism, pursuing independent foreign policy is equally important. Laos should work and fully cooperate with international community and avoid heavy dependence on any country whenever possible. The central government should provide a legal framework for local and provincial governments and ensure that it is fully enforced not just in papers. Government officials should never use their ranks or authority under any circumstances to intimidate citizens, appropriate disciplinary action must be brought against those who violate the rules. Moreover, arbitrators and judges should earn a minimum of a four-year degree in law in order to issue adjudication in any matter.
Can anyone confirm if he is King Savang Vatthana? I never saw Laotian King in my life. I assume the other one is his father
We need a person like u to run Laos country. Some people might disagree with my opion, but it's ok.
Hey, you are so kind to even say that. I don’t expect everybody has to agree with me, but at least they should not use a profane language. I sometime said something on purpose just to hit the nerve and that is how we wake up to reality. We might have a divergent opinion from time to time, but keep in mind that we all want the best for our country. Can you see how our Lao people had gone through in the past and some are still facing the same situation today. How many millions of our citizens still live in the huts? When will they ever get to have access to basic need? Their lives have been entangled with abject poverty for generation and millions could not live beyond the age of 50. That is pretty sad indeed. Governments from all levels have neglected the citizens for so long and it is time now to provide the utmost assistance to these people who don’t deserve any less attention, but rightfully deserve the same respect and dignity just like anybody else. Thanks again for your kind compliment.
I dont think we can declare ourself a neutral state if there is a conflict between China and Vietnam... because we are not economically strong enough, our military still lag behind Thai...assuming that if we have conflict with Thai, who will help us...
What we have to do is to wish that conflict between our two close friends will never happen...
I hope Laos will live in peace and prosperity with any more war... I want to see Laos developed not destroyed by the war again and again...
hypothetically speaking, if there is a conflict for influence in Laos between Vietnam and the People’s Republic of China, would Laos be able to declare neutrality without being dragged into a war by either side?
if the conflict between china and Vietnam happen today . tomorrow or in the future. i think Laos will be neural country. because we do believe the UN and the world can resolve the problem together and Laos loves peace,but not war, especially make a war giants the powerful country as china and brother like Vietnam.
Right now inside Lao PDR are underdog of Vietname and China. Lao PDR debt 1.7 billions dollars unable to pay back. sea game assistance China ,Vietname and ThaiLand. 1. Lao culture city hall in Vientiane (chinese) cost 6 million Dollars 2. Kaison Phomvihanh patriot kilomete 6 Dong Dok (vietname) cost 10 million dollar 3. Upgrade PatouXai Lanxang avenue (Chinese) Cost 2 million Dollar 4, Railraod Track Nong Khai, Thanaleng (Thailand) Cost 350 million bath 5. Upgrade Vattai International airport Vientiane (Japan) cost 54 million dollar 6. upgrade Loung Pra Bang Airport (Thailand) cost 2 million dollar 7. will upgrade for second times Loung Prabang international Airport (China) cost 57 million dollar 8. Upgrade Talat Sao Vientiane (singapore) cost 12 million dollar Least 30 years So on so on
I dont think we can declare ourself a neutral state if there is a conflict between China and Vietnam... because we are not economically strong enough, our military still lag behind Thai...assuming that if we have conflict with Thai, who will help us...
What we have to do is to wish that conflict between our two close friends will never happen...
I hope Laos will live in peace and prosperity with any more war... I want to see Laos developed not destroyed by the war again and again...
China and Vietnam has a long history of aggression against each other due to territorial dispute from land to sea. The potential confrontation always exists, but that doesn’t mean it is inevitable as long as Vietnam respects the Chinese interest then everything should be alright at least for time being. A modern-day China, however, is much more powerful than the Viet by many folds. Soon the Chinese Army, Navy and Air force will enter a world class military whereas Vietnam will be just an antiquated land base army in the 21st century.
Laos will have to learn how to adjust its foreign policy according to the situation and unity is the key to national survival. Backstabbing, betraying and selfishness among dignitaries will bring Laos to the bottom and all the good hope for all Laotians will be just another passing dream in this new century. Country and people must come first and Laos should never seek a foreign force to overthrow its government under no circumstances. Any resentment among politicians of pro-China or pro-Vietnam is to be solved peacefully through ballot not bullet for the sake of the country and creating a bi-partisan party to act as an arbitrator is highly recommended.
A political conflict with Thailand is imaginable, but military conflict is very unlikely in a near-term or in a distant future and if there is a war with Thailand, they will overrun Laos in a matter of days due to a massive superior firepower and the sheer numbers and there will be no occupation merely invasion because of the international rule of law fully enforce by United Nation. Nonetheless, Thailand is somewhat a democratic country; it would be hard-pressed for its government to act independently without strong opposition from other parities.
bruce lao man i love this question and your answer...
dude i dont want to hate on any people, but the hmong did try to take advantage of the moment and try to create their own little place within laos... i dispise the action that they tried to take... we laos gave them a home and a place to educated and a chance to become brothers with us but instead they tried to take away from us... why???? for this i know laos can never trust the hmong. im not saying treat them as a second class cityzen but be careful with them. we must integrate them thats the only answer.
plus i would love to see laos neutral if anything were to ever happen. between china and vietnam. this is probably my evil side coming out butt we would gain alot if we were to stay neutral. vietname would undoubtedly lose. either we gain or china gains. we will be free from vietnams influence. which i believe is somewhat holding us back from our potentials. i see it as vietnam holding us back while china althought there are some hidden agendas will help us improve more.
and again this is just my opinion dont take my words and think i speak for all laotions. 22 cents
In that situation the Lao Government would have to play the role of the merchant in the moral story," Poverty and Wealth."
Once Wealth and Poverty approached a merchant and introduced themselves as Goddesses. The merchant offered his salutations to both of them and said: "May I know what brings you to my humble tenement?" The Goddess of Wealth said: "We want you to judge and tell us as to who is more beautiful between us two?"
The merchant was in a fix. He knew he was between the devil and the deep sea. If he were to declare wealth as more beautiful than poverty, poverty would curse him. If he were to declare poverty as more beautiful, than wealth, wealth would forsake him. However, he regained his composure and said: "I have great respect for you both. Would you please act according to my instructions? Then only I can judge properly." The Goddesses agreed. He said: "Mother wealth, would you please go to the entrance (gates) and walk into the house? Mother, poverty! Would you please walk from here towards the gates? I can have a good look at you both, from near and far." The two Goddesses did walk as the merchant wished them to. Then the merchant happily declared: "Mother wealth! You appear very beautiful when you enter the house. Mother poverty! You look very beautiful when you leave the house!" The Goddesses appreciated the wit and wisdom of the merchant. The Goddess of wealth happily stayed in his house while the Goddess of poverty cheerfully walked away.
In that situation the Lao Government would have to play the role of the merchant in the moral story," Poverty and Wealth."
Once Wealth and Poverty approached a merchant and introduced themselves as Goddesses. The merchant offered his salutations to both of them and said: "May I know what brings you to my humble tenement?" The Goddess of Wealth said: "We want you to judge and tell us as to who is more beautiful between us two?"
The merchant was in a fix. He knew he was between the devil and the deep sea. If he were to declare wealth as more beautiful than poverty, poverty would curse him. If he were to declare poverty as more beautiful, than wealth, wealth would forsake him. However, he regained his composure and said: "I have great respect for you both. Would you please act according to my instructions? Then only I can judge properly." The Goddesses agreed. He said: "Mother wealth, would you please go to the entrance (gates) and walk into the house? Mother, poverty! Would you please walk from here towards the gates? I can have a good look at you both, from near and far." The two Goddesses did walk as the merchant wished them to. Then the merchant happily declared: "Mother wealth! You appear very beautiful when you enter the house. Mother poverty! You look very beautiful when you leave the house!" The Goddesses appreciated the wit and wisdom of the merchant. The Goddess of wealth happily stayed in his house while the Goddess of poverty cheerfully walked away.
Once Wealth and Poverty approached a merchant and introduced themselves as Goddesses. The merchant offered his salutations to both of them and said: "May I know what brings you to my humble tenement?" The Goddess of Wealth said: "We want you to judge and tell us as to who is more beautiful between us two?"
The above statements are yours for sure based on the broken English, but the ones below are nice though and thanks for sharing. Where did you get this story from? By the way, your Username is somewhat cool too. Sorry I forgot to add the emoticon
The merchant was in a fix. He knew he was between the devil and the deep sea. If he were to declare wealth as more beautiful than poverty, poverty would curse him. If he were to declare poverty as more beautiful, than wealth, wealth would forsake him. However, he regained his composure and said: "I have great respect for you both. Would you please act according to my instructions? Then only I can judge properly." The Goddesses agreed. He said: "Mother wealth, would you please go to the entrance (gates) and walk into the house? Mother, poverty! Would you please walk from here towards the gates? I can have a good look at you both, from near and far." The two Goddesses did walk as the merchant wished them to. Then the merchant happily declared: "Mother wealth! You appear very beautiful when you enter the house. Mother poverty! You look very beautiful when you leave the house!" The Goddesses appreciated the wit and wisdom of the merchant. The Goddess of wealth happily stayed in his house while the Goddess of poverty cheerfully walked away.
I dont think we can declare ourself a neutral state if there is a conflict between China and Vietnam... because we are not economically strong enough, our military still lag behind Thai...assuming that if we have conflict with Thai, who will help us...
What we have to do is to wish that conflict between our two close friends will never happen...
I hope Laos will live in peace and prosperity with any more war... I want to see Laos developed not destroyed by the war again and again...
China and Vietnam has a long history of aggression against each other due to territorial dispute from land to sea. The potential confrontation always exists, but that doesn’t mean it is inevitable as long as Vietnam respects the Chinese interest then everything should be alright at least for time being. A modern-day China, however, is much more powerful than the Viet by many folds. Soon the Chinese Army, Navy and Air force will enter a world class military whereas Vietnam will be just an antiquated land base army in the 21st century.
Laos will have to learn how to adjust its foreign policy according to the situation and unity is the key to national survival. Backstabbing, betraying and selfishness among dignitaries will bring Laos to the bottom and all the good hope for all Laotians will be just another passing dream in this new century. Country and people must come first and Laos should never seek a foreign force to overthrow its government under no circumstances. Any resentment among politicians of pro-China or pro-Vietnam is to be solved peacefully through ballot not bullet for the sake of the country and creating a bi-partisan party to act as an arbitrator is highly recommended.
A political conflict with Thailand is imaginable, but military conflict is very unlikely in a near-term or in a distant future and if there is a war with Thailand, they will overrun Laos in a matter of days due to a massive superior firepower and the sheer numbers and there will be no occupation merely invasion because of the international rule of law fully enforce by United Nation. Nonetheless, Thailand is somewhat a democratic country; it would be hard-pressed for its government to act independently without strong opposition from other parities.
-- Edited by BruceLaoMan at 21:12, 2008-10-05 Bruce, If you stay in Laos many year and knew the reality about the facts of Laos, maybe you may not have answered like this...'
Now we are like small fish in Ocean...even you declare your self as neutrality, who will listen to you... big fish will always eat small fish, this is the rotation of nature... hence, my point is... by now we are still not able to be neutral unless we develop ourself to be more enoughly modernised.... facts that could protect our self are from inside,,,( strong economy and reserves could protect ourself even we dont declare a neutral state)..
bruce lao man i love this question and your answer...
dude i dont want to hate on any people, but the hmong did try to take advantage of the moment and try to create their own little place within laos... i dispise the action that they tried to take... we laos gave them a home and a place to educated and a chance to become brothers with us but instead they tried to take away from us... why???? for this i know laos can never trust the hmong. im not saying treat them as a second class cityzen but be careful with them. we must integrate them thats the only answer.
plus i would love to see laos neutral if anything were to ever happen. between china and vietnam. this is probably my evil side coming out butt we would gain alot if we were to stay neutral. vietname would undoubtedly lose. either we gain or china gains. we will be free from vietnams influence. which i believe is somewhat holding us back from our potentials. i see it as vietnam holding us back while china althought there are some hidden agendas will help us improve more.
and again this is just my opinion dont take my words and think i speak for all laotions. 22 cents
Never mind the Hmong; they were given a false hope by their leader in the past and as long as they recognize the mistake and are willing to be part of the society, we should forgive them. What the Hmong people need in Laos is the long overdue acculturation and assimilation if they want to have any future for their posterity. Laos is too small, too weak and too poor to be divided into two separate states. The best choice for the Hmong is to coexist peacefully with the rest of Laotian citizens and fully respect the country’s constitution, the rule of law in all levels so as to share any potential hope and dream within the society. It won’t be easy at first but as time goes by, everything might just fall in place accordingly. The government should airdrop leaflets throughout the jungle where suspected Hmong rebels hiding and urge them to give up their arms, guarantee their safety and promise full immunity for those who comply. The government needs to prove it with deeds, not just words to ease their fear.
In a reference to Vietnam, a powerful Laos is for sure not in their best interest, but don’t worry because Laos still has a long way to get there; as you know, to project military power without economic power is impossible and Vietnam is very well aware of the weakness and the strength of Laotian army unless we are used as a proxy by other power, we are far from being viewed as a threat to anyone. We will be a small land base army with 1950s technology for years to come. Having said that, I don’t believe Vietnam is holding us back, but assisting us instead so they can have the say more or less in our government’s foreign policy especially as Laos is edging closer to China and the only way for the Viet to maintain its influence is to make Laotians aware of its necessary assistance and engagement in our country. They would be more concerned of holding on to Laos than holding Laos back.
The Chinese without a doubt will become the next superpower though they might not reach their full potential unless they allow further reform in their bureaucracy and Laos can gain a lot out of this if we know how to adjust our foreign policy correctly. The Chinese might even evict the Vietnamese out of Laos without a single bullet shot. When I said declaring neutrality, I did not mean the foreign policy should be stagnant, but adaptation according to our national need was my implication. We would surreptitiously not explicitly put across our gratitude and loyalty to one another and the willingness to drop it in due time is quite important just like your employer would drop you for a dime when time comes despite of your 30 good years of service. By the way, thank you for your interest in reading my post. May peace remain with you and long live our Laos.
War make me sick. I have lived through it and don't want to see anything like that happen again. That is the reason why a lot of us are here in the US. To make it clear, time will tell. We don't know what will happen in the future. I just want to create a good life for our familly in this big world. Take care what is in front of you. Na mo ta sa.
dude i dont want to hate on any people, but the hmong did try to take advantage of the moment and try to create their own little place within laos... i dispise the action that they tried to take... we laos gave them a home and a place to educated and a chance to become brothers with us but instead they tried to take away from us... why???? for this i know laos can never trust the hmong. im not saying treat them as a second class cityzen but be careful with them. we must integrate them thats the only answer.
That was exactly what Vang Pao and His 10 gang members trying to do in 2007. You might recall seeing and hearing all over the TV's news. Hmongs in US, they don't say they are not part of Laos. They don't only want a piece of Laos, they want a whole piece of Laos. They have a leader, educated men/women, language, but they want a country to run. So they pick Laos. Had Vang Pao and his gangs succeed overthrowing Laos, can you image what would happen to Lao people? Would That Luang Stupa still stand tall? Would the name of Laos country have a face in the World's map. Lao people would have to learn Hmong language to stay in Laos country. So my Lao fellows, "No body loves us like we love each other"
I dont think we can declare ourself a neutral state if there is a conflict between China and Vietnam... because we are not economically strong enough, our military still lag behind Thai...assuming that if we have conflict with Thai, who will help us...
What we have to do is to wish that conflict between our two close friends will never happen...
I hope Laos will live in peace and prosperity with any more war... I want to see Laos developed not destroyed by the war again and again...
If we have conflict with Thai or any other countries is not because we would cause it, most likely it will be them. As you know, we are a very peaceful nation, unlike some of our neighbors. In the case of conflict, we don't need China or Vietnam to protect us. There's the United Nations that we can look to. Like Bruceman was saying we need to work with the international community. Work with everybody, not just depend on one nation, who really doing it for their own interest. Vietnam is getting all kind of Sh*t out from us and China is doing the same thing. To me, Laos is still an virgin nation, every countries want a piece of us.
dude i dont want to hate on any people, but the hmong did try to take advantage of the moment and try to create their own little place within laos... i dispise the action that they tried to take... we laos gave them a home and a place to educated and a chance to become brothers with us but instead they tried to take away from us... why???? for this i know laos can never trust the hmong. im not saying treat them as a second class cityzen but be careful with them. we must integrate them thats the only answer.
That was exactly what Vang Pao and His 10 gang members trying to do in 2007. You might recall seeing and hearing all over the TV's news. Hmongs in US, they don't say they are not part of Laos. They don't only want a piece of Laos, they want a whole piece of Laos. They have a leader, educated men/women, language, but they want a country to run. So they pick Laos. Had Vang Pao and his gangs succeed overthrowing Laos, can you image what would happen to Lao people? Would That Luang Stupa still stand tall? Would the name of Laos country have a face in the World's map. Lao people would have to learn Hmong language to stay in Laos country. So my Lao fellows, "No body loves us like we love each other"
I like what you said, but the Hmongs can dreams and plot on taking over Laos until Vang Pao rots and reborned again because that's never going to happen in a trillion years.
Hmomg migrant to Laos 1840 .In China Call Mia. In Laos call Meo. After 1975 Name change Hmong. Hmong mean free people. Dr YangDown is first person of Hmong got PHD major Social study from Sorbonne university in Paris France. He is the peson Change the name Meo to Hmong . Chinese People call Mia mean slave people.
The conflict between China and Vietnam would never happen, I suppose. Only stupid people like to make a war. Now is 21 century.
-- Edited by TSP at 01:39, 2008-10-06
You must have been studying too much in Singapore and maybe you need a break; otherwise, you might oversimplify everything without acknowledging the ongoing conflicts around the world. Mr. TSP!
It was not long ago Georgia launched a successful invasion to recover the breakaway provinces, but the rapid military intervention from Russia had caused the Georgian army in a complete annihilation and innocent civilians were caught in the middle of this brief but brutal war. Moreover, Russia flatly told Georgia and the world that “Russia now recognizes the independence of these two provinces with the guarantee of security” So, who are you going to call stupid here?
Are you aware of the incessant war in Kashmir, Sri Lanka, Afghanistan, Iraq, and in Philippines? They have been fighting for independence and many nations in Africa are still fighting until today. What about the Kurdistan? They too want independence and they’ve been fighting Turkey for years. Every day, the Turkish Air force bombs the living hell out of them. How about the Hezbollah war with Israel and the possible war of attrition between Iran and the Middle East? Can you simply rule this out and call it stupid?
The Spratly Islands and the Parcel Islands have always been the flashpoints between Vietnam and China. There had been sea battles and the last one I believe was in 1982 when the Chinese sunk the Vietnamese navy in the ocean and hundreds of its crews were perished. Neither China nor Vietnam has yet relinquished their claims of these Islands and both have very sensitive foreign policies toward one another. Remember, just because you are a good driver does not mean the bad driver can't kill you.
The conflict between China and Vietnam would never happen, I suppose. Only stupid people like to make a war. Now is 21 century.
-- Edited by TSP at 01:39, 2008-10-06
You must have been studying too much in Singapore and maybe you need a break; otherwise, you might oversimplify everything without acknowledging the ongoing conflicts around the world. Mr. TSP!
-- Edited by BruceLaoMan at 06:23, 2008-10-07
Hi Mr. Bruce,
Yes, I am really busy with my research. You are right. However, I do know the ongoing conflicts around the world. I sit in front of my computer from 9.00am till 10.00pm everyday. So sometimes, I also enjoy Internet by searching news online, either in English or Russian. By the way, thank you for your concern.
The fact that I said:” There would never be a conflict between China and Vietnam” is based on my databases or my understanding. I do not see any reason for them to fight each other. Both countries love peace, I do believe.
On top of that, I only see they currently have a good relation. Yes, it could be the case if USA supports Vietnam to attack China, which I do not see now. Vietnamese and Chinese people are smart. Now they enjoy peace, unlike some Western people who like to send their people to kill other nation, mainly innocent people.
Talking about the war in Georgia, I do know as well. I even know the big boss who was behind the conflict. I really hate a war in my nature.
I also know that lots people died in Iraq and Afghanistan. More than 4000 US soldiers have died so far in Iraq alone, but thank God, though, I don’t know how many Lao-American soldiers have sacrificed their lives there.
